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Jan. 22, 2025

The Secret to Making Employees Want to Return to the Office

Are your office spaces missing the amenities that employees truly value?

In today’s hybrid workforce world, employers are finding it harder than ever to bring their teams back to the office. Without the right amenities, your property might struggle to attract and retain tenants who want to create inspiring work environments for their employees.

What if you could create an office space so appealing that employees actually want to come back? Tom Larance, Founder of The Experience Group, shares the amenities and strategies that make the modern workplace a destination.

BY THE TIME YOU FINISH LISTENING, YOU’LL LEARN:

  • The key trends driving people back to the office, including wellness spaces and tenant lounges
  • Why community and collaboration are critical to a successful workplace
  • How older office buildings can stay competitive through thoughtful upgrades

Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Tom Larance
02:42 The Experience Group: Creating Destination-Worthy Spaces
05:51 Trends in Post-Pandemic Workspaces
12:29 Innovative Amenities and Enhancements
17:08 Revitalizing Older Office Buildings
22:38 The Joy of Change in Commercial Real Estate

How to Connect with Tom:
Website: TXG.live
LinkedIn: Tom Larance
Instagram: @TomLarance

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Connect with Aviva:

Chapters

00:00 - Introduction to Tom Larance

03:05 - The Experience Group: Creating Destination-Worthy Spaces

06:14 - Trends in Post-Pandemic Workspaces

12:52 - Innovative Amenities and Enhancements

17:31 - Revitalizing Older Office Buildings

23:01 - The Joy of Change in Commercial Real Estate

Transcript

Aviva (00:00)
This week's Listener of the Week is Maryann 3 Maryann, thank you so much for leaving us a five-star review. And for those of you listening, if you leave us a five-star review below, you might be next week's Listener of the Week, week, week. This week on Commercial Real Estate Secrets, we have Tom Larance

Tom is the founder of the Experience Group. Tom, thank you so much for being on the show today.

Tom Larance (00:30)
Thank you for having me. It's great to be here. I'm excited.

Aviva (00:34)
as are we, you have a very impressive background in commercial real estate. Can you tell the listeners who you are, what you do and how you got here?

Tom Larance (00:39)
Thank you.

Yes, yes, thank you. As you said, I'm Tom Larance. I'm the founder of the Experience Group. I started my first company in 2001, which was Corporate Concierge. And in that, we focused on providing amenities to the commercial real estate industry, focusing on the office sector across the United States, working for great partners like Jones Lang LaSalle, CB, Cushman, et cetera.

And after a few years in the industry, I branched out into the retail sector, working for at the time, general growth properties, now Brookfield and Mace Ridge and providing different concierge and experience services for those companies on the retail side. Then we found our way into the hospitality world with the hotel side and working with brands like Hyatt and Hilton.

And then some not as large, but in some residential complexes. In Chicago, we worked for Waterton and some of their upscale properties providing concierge and amenity management services. I ran that company through 2019 when my firm was acquired by JLL. And I was brought on to create their in-house experience management platform called XM by JLL.

was a fantastic experience. was there for a little over, I guess it was about four years and then found myself wanting to work on my own again. And then just this year I founded the experience group. So brought some of the original staff from corporate concierge service back. I say I've got the dream team. They're all super experts in their particular areas and we are, we're, back on the market again.

Aviva (02:31)
So, for someone who has never heard of the Experience Group, what do you do in the commercial real estate space?

Tom Larance (02:36)
Right.

Right. Our main focus is knowing, studying, and learning what is on trend, specifically now with this post pandemic and hybrid workforce. And owners and managers, management companies are looking at how to bring, how to manage this hybrid workforce. What is the best source and what is the best ideas to bring people back to the office?

And what we say that we do, and we do this in a variety of different ways, but what we say our goal is, is to create a destination-worthy environment, a destination-worthy asset. So we want to create the living room or the heart of the building, the heart of the shopping center, the heart of the hotel, and make it a place where people truly want to be. You know, we see a lot of statistics about how companies

how employees of companies are far more productive when there is a sense of community and a sense of camaraderie and just how during the pandemic we missed just those spontaneous conversations around the office, around the water cooler, around the coffee, around lunch. And...

But now that people can really work from home, what is it that is important and why is it important to bring people back? And what are we doing to create these really cool spaces that people want to be in? And that's what we do. And whether that's a tenant lounge, which includes fitness, fitness is a little different right now than pre-pandemic. We're moving a little bit more towards wellness. We're seeing things like

Aviva (04:18)
Hmm.

Tom Larance (04:19)
Red light therapy versus people actually getting on the treadmill. They're still getting in doing the workout But now that people are in the building on this hybrid On this hybrid schedule they're using the fitness center in a different capacity than what they did and So again, like we're seeing the infrared saunas. We're seeing cold plunges, which is popping up It's a hot thing right now and we're seeing those types of services some of these

Med spas we've actually are doing a lot of these med spas services including boat Botox in the in these spaces. It's really it's cool So we are studying those differences and we're bringing that to the table for our managers and our owners our clients about what is on trend as We are always looking at what is the best way to provide an environment that's destination worthy where our

tenants and employees want to be. And it's a super cool opportunity and we're lucky to be in this environment really creating new spaces. It's cool.

Aviva (05:30)
You know, we are in a world that seems to be changing every day, every minute, every hour. How do you combat this society where our desires are, right? Like suddenly we're in a cold plunge world. How do you keep up with the trends as they're so quickly changing in something like a commercial space where...

Ideally, you would want to have it for as long as possible to maximize the value.

Tom Larance (06:02)
Sure, absolutely. I think that the things, even though we say that they're on trend right now, I think there things that are going to be here for a while. And part of what I said in starting the experience group, I've created the dream team again. And I have Jessica Schmidt on my team who is our creative director and she researches and studies. so it's not a trend that's going to happen for a quarter or

you know, half the year. It's something, you know, why are people interested in these wellness services? And we have research that backs up, you know, there was a recent poll that said about what is what is one of the the biggest challenges that people are facing coming out of the pandemic, post pandemic, what have you, and they're really interested in wellness.

and bringing themselves and having that sense of community and camaraderie. And what we see with things while the cold plunge is somewhat new for our office environment, I think it's going to be here for quite some time. And I'm actually seeing some of the fitness components. We're working with a client right now in Chicago that is converting a lot of the physical,

the workout space into wellness spaces. And we're already interviewing, mean, literally building spaces for people to come to versus the physical workout, to have the red light therapy, to have whatever this is that they're looking to better themselves on a wellness, also on a mental wellness journey. And we're seeing that as incredibly important for people as they come back to the office because

We spent a lot of time alone and now we crave being back together.

Aviva (07:55)
What other trends are you seeing coming out of this pandemic that people are craving in the workspace?

Tom Larance (08:03)
Well, I would say that sort of the sweet spot is when a building has the resources to dedicate the right amount of space to a tenant lounge that includes maybe in the morning a barista and some grab and go. Like I said, the fitness wellness element, a combination of a community manager that oversees all of these things and conference spaces.

that with catering and then food and beverage is just so hot right now and has been for some time. at, so at one of our accounts, they have a bar that opens up in at three o'clock closes at seven. This is not intended to be your local cheers. It would close us down at seven o'clock. This is the place to come and have some social.

interaction with your colleagues and it is so popular and we do provide food and snacks and it's fascinating how our provider there really also does research on who is in the building and this building in particular has a lot of millennials. I've never seen more avocado toast or avocado prepared in different ways than I have seen at this place but also these craft cocktails that are really just fascinating. I mean it really is creating an experience.

And that is sort of the sweet spot for our owners. But we're also talking to folks in the suburban markets. I was recently in Boston talking to some brokers about what type of, if we don't have the space or the budget for this amazing tenant lounge, what are some of the things that we can do? And some of our research showed in this particular market how,

people are really bringing their pets to the office, mostly their dogs, they're bringing the pets to the office. And we are now, took that conversation and we are really talking to them about doing pet care, mobile pet care. We're looking at designing an outdoor pet facility where people can take a break and take their animals. It's enclosed so it's a safe space. But it's a lot of place, a lot of...

Opportunity for the for the dogs to do a you know, it's it's basically a dog park that is Contained for the number of people that are bringing their animals to the office. I mean we've also Been working and in conjunction with some local DMVs DMVs some mobile DMV so you can renew your driver's license Right on the property right at work versus having to go down to your local DMV space. It's so cool

Aviva (10:42)
Wow.

Tom Larance (10:44)
I mean, it's a simple

Aviva (10:44)
Yeah.

Tom Larance (10:45)
thing, right? It's nothing, it's not, it's not ingenious, but taking them, taking that service to where people are versus them having to go there is such a cool twist. And I can't tell you how popular, well, you can imagine. mean, everyone just loves that. They just love

Aviva (11:00)
Well, you now as we talk about it, it's almost like the opportunities are limitless. What you can do to enhance the experience in a building, don't, we don't even know because maybe it's like you said, like who would have thought putting a DMV kiosk in an office building would be such an attractive feature. And it is.

Tom Larance (11:22)
It is, and now we're taking that and we're booking it at all the different properties because it's so popular, everybody wants that. It's as things continue to change and as technology continues to be able to provide us these services where before it didn't exist. I mean, we're in such a creative space that technology is allowing us to be in. It's just, it's fantastic.

Aviva (11:48)
You know, I think about pre-pandemic. I had a friend, lives in LA, and he goes to the WeWork. And his selling points to the WeWork were there's kombucha on draft, and there's cold brew, and there's a printer. And I'm just thinking to myself, like, I got cold brew at home, I have a printer, but these amenities within this space created this experience where he could justify paying

Tom Larance (11:56)
Sure.

That's right.

Aviva (12:17)
to go to the office. I'm not telling you anything you don't know. This is what you do for a living. It's so interesting how it's like you said, as people we crave community and the experience group creates the heart of the community in order to elevate the real estate in general.

Tom Larance (12:29)
That's right.

That's right.

Absolutely correct. And there there's research that that backs up that that people really really look at what are their amenities? What what is the building offering? Why do I want to be here versus at another property versus when I do the printer and kombucha at home? Why am going to be here and? We're creating the space what I call, you know and a lot of people whether it's a we work or your your typical office space

Aviva (12:57)
Yeah.

Tom Larance (13:08)
People want to get out of their home again and they want to collaborate with their other colleagues. They want to feel a part of something. some people, you know, it also it all depends, you know, also on a person's home work environment. Not everyone has a home office. I'm lucky enough to have a home office here that I can that we can talk about. But but you know, some people are working from the kitchen counter and from the dining room table. And it's it's such a.

People are finding it is a pleasure and a joy to come back and interact with their colleagues in person and not remotely. And we want to enhance that experience. We really want to create this, make the spaces, make the asset a destination that is commute worthy. And really it's the heart and the living room of the office.

Aviva (14:00)
Do you have any examples or sample situations that stand out to you where it was just a grand slam in terms of adding these environments to a property?

Tom Larance (14:15)
I think that there are a couple of examples. I was working on a project at the Aon Center in Chicago, and I just think that that ownership had knocked it out of the ballpark. They do these things so well. And that particular lounge is called the Cloud Level. It's on the 70th floor of the building. The views are spectacular. The appointments are amazing. It's just knocked out of the ballpark. It's absolutely stunning.

actually is also in Chicago, same ownership when they redeveloped the asset called the old post office and just an incredible redevelopment of a historic sort of property that had been abandoned for 20 plus years. just an incredible job what the amenities and how ownership has amenitized that particular property. And then we worked on a project in Boston where

the, it was an actually a full consulting opportunity where the ownership was redoing the mezzanine level, putting a new food provider in the lobby, sort of a grab and go coffee, you know, food, grab and go kind of a thing, which then led up to the mezzanine level. And we consulted on, with a partner of ours on the design.

Everything in the fixtures everything up to finally turning that over to the building Architect for the final stamp on it. It was an incredible incredible project and One that I think is really driving new traffic for that asset

Aviva (15:49)
Very cool. So something we're seeing, and I'm sure you hear about this all day, you know, we have these office buildings in America, all these office buildings that were built in the 70s and the 80s. And now we have the office buildings that are being built now. calling a spade a spade, nobody wants to be in the old buildings. They're smaller windows, less accessible, less sexy, less amenity opportunities.

Whereas these new gorgeous office buildings are floor to ceiling windows. Do you feel like what do you feel like the future of these 70 these buildings built in the 70s and 80s holds? Do you think it's amenitizing it like you do? Do you think it's tearing them down? Balance of the two? I'm curious as to your thoughts.

Tom Larance (16:21)
Right? That's right.

It's interesting. was just at a seminar yesterday in Chicago and they were talking about this and there were some representation from the city and they were talking about how in some specific areas it makes sense to do office conversion to residential. Not in all, but when it makes sense.

They're seriously looking at this. They're doing something different and called what's called the LaSalle corridor where they are doing some office conversion to residential. And it's also but but the main message that I heard from that was we have really cool buildings. Some of them are aging. It's true, but better to repurpose when possible, but also to

Really upgrade also impossible and this this seminar took place at One East Wacker. It's an am trust property and they just redid an entire floor That is absolutely stunning. It has everything you'd want in a tenant lounge and That is an example of perhaps one of those it's not a brand new building, but they have redone

really thought through in a really great way how to revitalize that particular office building with, know, the lobby is different now and they have this beautiful tenant lounge. I think there's room for every possible thought. And I think that what I'm seeing is people really being thoughtful in what is, what is right for this asset. And you're right, the new buildings are just incredible as well. mean,

You look at the New York market now where amenities in the office buildings were very rare. And now one Vanderbilt just out of the ground is completely amenitized. It's unbelievable. So I do think it's a mix. I think it's a mix of things. I think that we're going to continue to see that. And I think that it's going to be fascinating also to watch the Chicago downtown market as the JPMorgan Chase Bank building is going to be.

revamped and how Google is also moving back to the central business district and they're redoing that building, as you said, from, you know, it's an older building and they're completely remodeling it. So I think it's a combination.

Aviva (19:04)
I think about lifetime fitness and how they have childcare in the lifetime fitness and how much of a driver that can be. I mean, I know the lifetime fitness here in Denver, it's got a wait list. It's, you know, you can't even show up anymore. Yeah, it's crazy. And it's very interesting. It's that same concept of bringing everything. It's like a mixed use world now. It's no longer.

Tom Larance (19:20)
Wow. Wow.

That's right.

Aviva (19:32)
This is your

office building. This is your bar. It's. Here's a community within a building.

Tom Larance (19:36)
That's right. That's right. And we're seeing

this also on the retail side, you know, where there is the shopping complex, there is the hotel that's also on property, residential on property, and even office. We're seeing this and you know, I just think it's such an exciting time in this, in all of these arenas to figure out what is the best use case for

every particular asset. it's not one size does not fit all. That is for sure.

Aviva (20:09)
Okay, not to put my landlord hat on, but when you do your, when you amenitize a building, hypothetically, does that expense get passed to the tenant and therefore you can justify it to the landlord?

Tom Larance (20:24)
Oftentimes it can be an operating expense. Sometimes it all depends on how the landlord chooses to create that, but it can certainly be, and part of operating that space is generally speaking, an operating expense. And it can be a capital expenditure. just, you know, again, it depends on how the ownership sets that up.

Aviva (20:48)
commercial real estate because it is still the Wild West and, you know, I, I heard, I've heard stories about owners in New York where the building might be 80,000 square feet, but the lease says the building's 85,000 square feet. it's like, but if somebody perceives a building one way and they own it, party on. no, it's,

Tom Larance (20:52)
It is the Wild West.

Ha ha ha ha!

Party on.

Aviva (21:17)
It's fascinating what you do, specifically given, like I said, we're just starting to see the opportunities that it holds for owners, tenants, and communities in general.

Tom Larance (21:33)
I think so.

Aviva (21:35)
Tom, what makes you happy with what you do in commercial real estate every day?

Tom Larance (21:41)
Gosh, I mean, I think we've touched base on that. To me, the thing that makes me happy, that I find so exciting, is that everything is constantly changing. We're in a different world now, and it is exciting to be a part of the change that's happening. It's so cool to...

to research and to bring to the table and help managers and ownership figure out what is the right move, what is the next thing, what is the cool thing for your particular asset. And consulting in a way and then bringing those spaces to life,

It's been an absolute pleasure and joy to have a career in this industry. It's been so fun. And we've evolved. I I started this in 2001 when we were concierge in an office building to then starting with different technologies and bringing on CRMs and then going from the concierge in the lobby to the community manager that runs an entire space for the building and bringing in, working with the creative people.

Aviva (22:35)
Yeah.

Tom Larance (22:50)
that I have on staff to really bring the cool stuff to ownership. it just, it's so fulfilling. It's just been a fantastic career choice for me. And working with the people that I get to work with is also incredible.

Aviva (23:07)
Sounds like every day is different for you.

Tom Larance (23:09)
Yes, yes, that's true. I hadn't really thought of it that way, but that's true and it's part of the plus. You're absolutely right.

Aviva (23:13)
Hahaha

Tom, we really appreciate having you on the show. Your story and line of work is really unique. I talk to people all day, every day about everything commercial estate. I was really excited to have you on the show because of, like I said, how unique your experience is in this industry. Where can the listeners find you, follow you, contact you? We've got a lot of owners who listen to this podcast. What's the best way to find you?

Tom Larance (23:46)
Sure, we are at TXG.live is our website. I'm on LinkedIn. have Instagram. We're out there. Happy to connect in any way that works. That would be terrific. Thank you.

Aviva (24:02)
Absolutely, we'll put all your info in the show notes. So anybody who's listening, stare at your screen and you can connect. Tom, thank you for your time today. I know you're over in the East Coast and we're wrapping up a Friday and for everybody listening, we'll see you next week.

Tom Larance (24:07)
Thank you.

It's my pleasure, thank you. Yes.

Yes.


 

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